US knew about Indonesia 1960s massacres

Discussion in 'In the News' started by Nasigan, Oct 18, 2017.

  1. Nasigan

    Nasigan Member Charter Member Cager

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    From BBC news app. under Asia.
    Newly declassified documents show US embassies knew about about the mass killings in Indonesia in the 1960s..!
    interesting to read and specially the involvement of Muslim militias.
     
  2. waarmstrong

    waarmstrong Well-Known Member Charter Member Cager

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    Anyone who cared to look knew. Not much of a revelation.
     
  3. Nasigan

    Nasigan Member Charter Member Cager

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    Yes, but in Indonesia who cared to look into this, not to much people because there where no documents to really proof something now we have this declassified documents from a well informed source.
    Related to this, a few weeks ago the Indonesian armee was showing in a nearby kampung this movie recently made by the armee with the support of general G and Tommy Soeharto, this film is supposed to tell the "true" story about what happens in 1965-66...
    They invited the people true the speakers of the mosque to come and watch, I did not go there, but why they showing this movie in different kampung ? I suspect that they want "brainwashing" the simple kampung people to prepare the next presidential election where this general G is already showing big interest to try to become president.
    Are we slowly going back to a kind of Soeharto time but this time with the support of this Muslim fascist groups ? I truly hope not.
     
  4. harryopal

    harryopal Active Member Charter Member

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    There is ample evidence that the US was not just passively in the know about the slaughter but encouraged, aided and abetted the processes.

    The US, as with all major powers, have been determined to protect and further their interests by whatever means necessary. The history of US involvement in the murderous politics of Central America are just another example of the kind of imperialist policies going back to the Roman Empire. England's history in India and other colonies was also shaped by these principles. Russia, China where ever you look along with fine words about believing in justice and the dignity of man the ugly reality is governments will do whatever they see as needing to be done.

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    [1] Kenneth J. Conboy, Intel: Inside Indonesia's Intelligence Service (Jakarta: Equinox Publishing, 2004), p. 47.

    Suharto’s rise to power started in his response to the 30 September Movement of 1965. Various theories are present in academia detailing the inspiration for the 30 September Movement, however the CIA stated that it was a leftist plot. In a memo on political forces in Indonesia, the CIA asserted that the army was upset with Sukarno’s leftist tendencies and were looking to force Sukarno out of power or incentivize the PKI, the communist party, to attack the state. The 30 September Movement was a failure that resulted in the death of six top army generals. The Reds were influenced by the CIA to eliminate 6 Indonesian generals. Due to there being no practice the generals were killed brutally. In the De Murville speech they had said that the attack allowed a bond to be formed between east and west Pakistan. They also discussed the withdrawal of the US from Vietnam and the rejection of Pak demands. During the US involvement of Vietnam the agents were told to disguise themselves as Viet Cong and do things against the people in order to cause more hatred to appear.[29] Following the failed mission and assassination of the generals, Suharto then seized the opportunity to take control of the armed forces. He used the event to sanction a crackdown on communists who were deemed to be behind the coup plot.[30] It must be noted that Major General Suharto was appointed by President Sukarno.....

    In August, the Under Secretary of State requested a Special National Intelligence Estimate (SNIE) on communism in Indonesia. The July NIE about Indonesia's political conditions was insightful, but the Under Secretary specifically wanted more information about communism and how a communist government would impact Indonesia and any surrounding or associating countries, especially in the Far East. This request was sent to DCI William F Raborn, for the SNIE to be prepared and submitted in September.[32]

    In November 1965, another coup was attempted but also proved unsuccessful. According to the president's Daily Briefs, Sukarno wanted to send a message to both military officials and the press. First he wanted to make it clear that Indonesia was in alliance with the Communist axis that included North Vietnam, China, and Cambodia, and that their allegiance was against "American Imperialism." Also, he wanted to make it known that he found the media of the time to be slanderous of their regime, their party, and other Communist governments. He minimized the effect of the coup and voiced further intent of resistance to the American forces.[33] In the same year, the left-leaning government of Sukarno was overthrown in a military coup by General Suharto. The new military quickly went after everybody who was opposed to the new regime. Non-violent communist supporters, Indonesian women's movements, trade union movement organizers and activists, intellectuals, teachers, land reform advocates, and the ethnic Chinese were all targeted. Over the course of about two years, it is estimated now by survivors, that as many as 2,500,000 of these people were massacred. The CIA'a World Factbook phrases it this way: "Soekarno was gradually eased from power."[1]

    The U.S. was very much involved with providing money, weapons, radios, and supplies to this new government. The U.S. government along with the CIA provided death lists with names of leftist public leaders with the intents to eliminate them. The United States wanted the Indonesian army to go after and remove the entire grass roots base of the leftist party. It is alleged that without the US financial support, the massacres would have been non existent or less extreme (as the US had bankrolled the whole process).

    According to documentation declassified in the late 90s and released in 2001 pertaining to the Indonesian Army's fight against the Indonesian Communist Party, the U.S. Embassy originally stated that 50-100 PKI members were being killed nightly. In an airgram to Washington in April 1966, the estimated fatalities had reached between 100,000 and 1,000,000.

    The United States involvement in these situations is marked with controversy in and of itself - according to an August 1966 airgram from Marshall Green stated that the U.S. Embassy prepared a list of Communist leaders with attribution to the Embassy removed, and that list was being used by Indonesian security officials that lacked an extreme amount of overt knowledge on Communist officials.[35]
     
  5. Anglian

    Anglian Well-Known Member Charter Member Cager

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    My Father in Law was rounded up with several other men in his Kampung, he returned several days later, the others didn’t, he sadly passed away this year, but he would never discuss it, he was a blacksmith /farmer and had no interest in politics, left or right
     
  6. harryopal

    harryopal Active Member Charter Member

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    Sorry to hear that Anglian. I am afraid it is usually the poorest who are most often the victims of excesses during such troubled times. I spent a bit of time in Central America when the civil war was taking place in El salvador. I met wretchedly poor refugees in a camp in Honduras who had fled after they had approached the farm owner to see if they could earn a little more. They were lucky to get two meals a day of beans. The landowners response was to denounce them as Communists and call in the armed forces to deal with them.
    I once interviewed a cousin of Roberto D'Aubuisson who operated one of the worst death squads in El Salvador. He was nicknamed "blow torch Bob" as he liked to use the blowtorch in interrogations. I asked this young woman why the work of the squads was so vicious? Not just killing people identified as leftists but torturing and mutilating their victims.
    Her answer was, "The people need discipline.".
     
  7. Asun

    Asun Member

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    Huh? I thought everyone already knows that Suharto was a CIA operative or at least backed by CIA. The real coup was to blame it on the Communist and the subsequent slaughter of thousands of lives.
     
  8. steveandpenny

    steveandpenny Active Member Cager

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    Lol no shit ! At that time it was the great commie scare. The U.S.A. was doing all sorts of nasty things around the world to stop those pinkos. From South America to the far East.
    Every act against a possible communist threat had our finger prints all over it.
     
  9. Supir Angkot

    Supir Angkot Member Charter Member Cager

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    ^Way back then even a whiff of Vodka sniffing would get you branded as a Commie let alone setting up secretive communications with the Russians with the sole purpose to undermine the presidential election.
     
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